Do Arsenal fans expect too much?
Following on from Toby’s Guest Post yesterday when he questioned whether Cesc Fabregas should still be Arsenal’s captain. Today he asks an interesting question about the general expectations of Gooners around the world…..
How do we measure success at Arsenal
After what was my first article on our captain, I shall move away from a subject that is obviously too raw and difficult to discuss for many fans, and ask my next question. What will it take from our young team to make the fans happy ?
Although at first glance it appears a silly question and requiring little thought to answer, it does appear to be worth asking, and on closer inspection not quite so clear cut.
The general consensus from the fans thoughts is that only silverware will suffice, but i put it back to the fans to have an open mind and see what is realistic to expect from the players (and management) this season.
Firstly, in my opinion, all you can expect from any team is to be moving forwards and improve on the year before, so by that yardstick surely we have already had a good season as we are in a Cup Final and competing for all major honours. We are also in a position to challenge for the Premier League title as well, something we never looked like doing at any point last season. So on the basis of points made above would it be fair to say all the boxes have been ticked already.
On the other side of the coin i have come across many disgruntled fans who think anything less than the League title or Champions League glory just wouldn’t be acceptable. These same fans claim that the Carling cup is a nonsense, which i find extremely ironic as i would love to see the match but have more chance of becoming one of the queens corgi’s than getting tickets for that game. So it must mean something to a large number of fans. Also the demand for big money to be spent and big names acquired seems to be getting louder each day. I even heard cries for Wenger’s head at one point over the weekend, surely this is going too far…
My personal opinion (not sure after the Cesc article its going to be wanted) is that each team should be judged on its own merit, and not against one another for a true measure of their success. Many factors can come into it like profitability (Gooners despise this word), youth development, financial stability and stadium attendances. My point is there’s a lot more to being a successful club than the contents of its trophy cabinet.
I wouldn’t trade any trophy for the standards Arsene has set and the football we play, i believe in his youth policy and all that the club stands for, and if this brings trophies i will be overjoyed. If it doesn’t i can live with it. But what do you guys think? And more importantly what would you consider success ?
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I have only truly started supporting arsenal FC for this season. I didn’t experience the pain that most gooners are going the through this past few years without big signings or trophies. but i became a fan only because of wenger’s policies(and ofcourse the stadium too). I think he has really converted talent into class in a short period of time like ramsey,wilshere,walcott,nasri, fabregas …… not too many clubs are capable of that and they are certainly not the ones that win. so even if we win atleast one trophy, make a lot of profit and give a good fight for the rest of the campaign, only good things are to come in the future. so i would say its very succesful club
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The brand of football Arsenal play, i am just happy that i support a club which plays Football in the manner that justifies it i.e The Beautiful Game.Arsenal just personify the game in its true sense…
Having hard day at work,then watch Arsenal plays at their superior sublime free flowing way just makes the day perfect..
Success is important though,we need to win some trophies not just for the sake of winning and the rich history , but for the players who work hard for the club.
If we dont win we will loose key players season by season.
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There is no doubt whatsoever that Wenger’s policy is reaping the benefits and that in a matter of three to four years we will have a strong stable squad capable of challenging any team in the world….But the problem is that the barren period in between marks a period of no success in the club…..For me success would be when we win our trophies with the attractive style of football that we play…..And that is where wenger has gone wrong in his master plan…while he has thought them the beautiful side of the game he has forgotten about the ugly one…Why are Barca succesful? Because they can play the tough tackling game just as well…..One just needs to look at last years match at the Emirates for an example(second half in particular)……….And wenger has the resources to correct it but he wont…..Spending 15-20 mil. on a top quality center back wont affect the stability of the club nor will it hinder the development of the youger players since Squillaci is nearing his retirement soon,,,,, Had Wenger spent some good amount on a top class player like Gary Cahill or Mertesacker im sure we would have been in a better position in these last 6 years…..Also letting William Gallas go was a big mistake…..He might not be the most cheerful or enthusiastic but he will go into the tackels hard and lead the side….You could see him shouting at the defenders and egging them on….same goes for Kolo Tore ….So in my opinion while the professor has taken the club forward by leaps and bounds he has left behind major holes that still need plugging…..
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Success is judged ultimatly by trophies but having said that i can remember supporting the club when they won hardly anything and played shit football. Most of my formative years as a gooner were only brightened by flashes of genius by Liam Brady and then Charlie Nicholas.
The fans i here moaning now didn’t have to suffer some of the dross i watched as a child and young man and if they did they would be thankful for the exciting brand of attacking football we now play. I do desperatly want us to start winning things again soon and yes maybe another top class CB wouldn’t go amiss but we are very close to having a great team so lets get behind the team like we did against Everton last week when im sure the noise and atmosphere created by the crowd dragged the boys to a good win.
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Good companies DO NOT state “making profits” as their VISION or MISSION as they expect good profits will come if they are well organized around a few timeless values that can motivate and win the trust of employees, customers and other stakeholders all of whom are also potential employees and customers.
Also, as with competition in a class, all students must strive very hard to come first but must realize that it is only one person that will take that position despite the respect best efforts of everyone else. The students and their respective parents must learn to live with and deal with this reality. It is, indeed, a very strange parent that thrashes a child that is consistently rated among the top 10% in his class just because he is yet to come first.
I believe Arsenal has defined playing good football and making AFC an environment that nurture youths to do so in a challenging, caring, realistic and sustainable environment and at the highest possible level as its vision/mission. And believing that doing so will sooner or later reap trophies consistently and sustainably.
Obviously,this vision/mission is not good enough for many fans but I think it is not enough reason for Arsenal to change the vision. In time, many fans will come to see the virtue in the vision and some will other fans will find it necessary to drift away.
Trophy or no trophy, my expectation is that Arsenal should continue to keep the faith with its vision – as it has been doing since Wenger was recruited as manager and more so, in the past 5years.
Apparently, this is not good enough for many support
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great article
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Good article.
True supporters support their club no matter what. Arsenal are fantastic (and yes sometimes frustrating) to watch and challenge in the top competitions. I’m desperate for them to win (as every supporter is) and I’m sure they will this season. But if the don’t I will stay optimistic and hopeful for next season.
People seem to forget that the “youth project” is not a permanent thing. Wenger started it a number of years ago and it is truly starting to work. As the players that have been developed at Arsenal start moving into their prime years you will see a truly great side emerge without the need for expensive additions.
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Completely agree.
The trophies will come sooner or later with the great attitude the club is cultivating. Hopefully it will be as soon as this year!
But, yes, If we don’t win. It won’t be heart – break because, like you say, the club has a great policy which keeps it going in the right direction…
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we have really great squard this season…dispite wenger released 9 players from the current squard last summer n he replace only 3 players and those are also not better then the players we have and had release…only pace was missing from gallas n he was real captin…eduardo was little short n he have lost his form from his broken leg…far better then chamakh.we all know loosing is part of game but wenger policy is costing little more then part of game…we have become predictable to any side… is wenger policy is benifeting to our players or to the game.. no way ….only to the owners n wenger 115 k….cesc is the only player who earns 100k at current arsenal squard that is keeping him for the moment at arsenal rest all earns below 75k. that’s why and how we loose the good players to aother club DNA bla bla bla.i have heard wenger is making good money for club, what is that for as we all know money cannot buy succese, it would be nice if he focous on the pitch as well buy adding some 2 or 3 new face it would cost few million and we will be as strong as financial on the pitch also cz his game plane is getting bed to worst n we forgot how to WIN the match. m i expecting too much from wenger.
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I’m a relatively new Arsenal supporter I’ve only been following them 5 years. They’ve never won a trophy during my time as a supporter and I didn’t start following them because they were winning trophies.
I actually think that gives me a much more relaxed and enjoyable experience as a supporter. I wasn’t around for the glory days of Henry and Bergkamp, I have no idea how it feels to see the team I love win a trophy so I don’t miss it at all.
In fact it was the way Arsenal play and the way they were going as a club that actually got me into football in the first place.
I trawl through the endless blogs every day and all I see from about 50% of fans is this attitude of instant gratification, instant success “buy this player, buy that player, we need this guy or that guy” It seems the glory days has bred a group supporters that don’t care about our team and don’t care about the clubs philosophy they just want trophies and bragging rights. I’d love to see our team win some trophies every fan wants that, but I would not for one second sacrifice our core principles to achieve that success because if you look around the teams that do that don’t stay successful for long.
Chelsea bought themselves into contention, then they stopped spending lots of money to try and get back to the reality of football and now look at what’s happening to them. They’ve been forced to spend big again because while they’ve been buying in, their youth players have been vanishing. The same happened to Liverpool, except the players they invested in were lemons, they lost alonso, one player and never replaced him adequately and they fell away.
United are a different animal, they stopped spending big after ronaldo left the only thing keeping them in contention is ferguson, he’s a genius of the highest order. I bet he could make a team out of all the people commenting on this blog and make us championship winning side, he’s got the midas touch.
Arsenal are the envy of all the other European sides, I know united fans that are jealous because they know that all the while Arsenal are building for the future, Man Utd are being kept afloat by Ferguson who doesn’t have long left at all, they know once he goes they don’t have a backup plan, there is no manager in the world that will be able to replace him.
They’re jealous because when they look at Arsenal they know what Wenger has created is a long term vision, Wenger has created a club that will be able to keep moving once he leaves. He’s created a complete culture at the club, so much so that any similar thinking manager will be able to slot in and learn quickly. Wengers on the pitch philosophy is not unique. He is one of many that love that style of playing, what is unique about Wenger is his vision of the overall club, that’s what he has given Arsenal and it’s something that will remain at Arsenal forever.
I’m very proud to be an Arsenal fan, we’re a safe and secure top side, and this season we are fighting on all 4 fronts.
Next wednesday will be one of our greatest triumphs, when we beat barcelona over the two legs and win the carling cup. No matter what happens after that this season will be the best in all the time I’ve supported Arsenal. Have no doubt we will beat barca because we will. We have the catalan jewel in their crown playing for us.
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Do you think that Nasri, RVP and Fabregas just want to play beautiful football?
Of course they want trophies and i dont think they want to wait another 5 years for trophies.
Wenger is very good manager but his too stubborn sometimes.
Sometimes Wenger knows the obvious problems in our team but doesnt resolve them.
He can easily fix the flaws in our team but i think he is too cheap. This season we needed some world class Centre-backs. He bought Koscielny and Squillacci. Ok Koscielny has been good but only with J.Djourou.
Squillacci is worse than Silvestre, when he came on for the injured Djourou in the famous Newcastle game i knew things would go bad.
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I believe in Wenger and what he is doing at the club. He has set a standard of Arsenal that all the clubs and people alike around the world respect it. They don’t think arsenal is a mere pity club. They think we are a strong team.
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Success in this sport is measured by trophies NOT the end of year profit/ loss. The players also share this sentiment and want to win trophies. Have you heard any of them say “well we didn’t win any trophies this year but hey, the club made some profits…”
That is also the reason why some players leave to join other clubs —> to win trophies. AW on the other hand seems to measure success by the profitability of the club. That is the only thing he has been bragging about to everyone.
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One team wins each tournament and it is both surprising and also heartening to see that Arsenal still have an interest in the middle of February for all these. Having said that no team can be expected to win “beautifully” every game and “luck” is a very important ingredient in winning trophies.
We have not enjoyed the best of luck for some years – injuries of key players has affected performances, but have we failed to improve,? – the answer must be no as this year we have already been more successful overall already. Luck with decisions also seems to desert us in some games which are difficult to digest.
All the other contenders in the EPL have had “bad days” with results going against them although the resilience of Man Utd is to be admired even though they do at times seem to ride their luck more than most! What we have to remember that even in all the games we have lost this year we have for a good part if not all the game been the better team, this cannot be said of all our competitors.
We can win this year one or two trophies realistically, but with the age and increased maturity in the squad and hopefully a few class additions over the next two or so years I can really see this team become the best again without spending the ridiculous amounts of money that is being touted for, in many cases, average players.
As only one team wins, what of all the other clubs who have bankrupted themselves to try to get there?, as we have seen in the present situation every one of those would swap their position with us without demur.
Arsenal is a club to be admired, who would have given Fabregas or Nasri, or Wilshire or Ramsay and many others a chance to become first team regulars at such tender ages – and of course we are now getting the benefit of this policy. All the other contenders give no credence to this and use the chequebook to solve all their problems with in some cases disastrous results and even where it is seen to be working will always lead to dressing room disquiet due to massive differential in wage structures internally and little or no game time for some expensive acquisitions.
We should set our expectations realistically but I really expect this club to be picking up many trophies over the next few years with the players it already has.
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all i know is win or loose i will be the 1st person to support the gunners and the start of every season. coz we play good football and there are limited clubs who play like us and we are improving every year
would be nice to win a trophy consistantly every season but hey ho, we are playing in one of the hardest leagues in the world with kids who can get results and that is amazing in my eyes
gooner 4 life
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I Agree Carling Cup and any other trophy too will be cool to me, Great play is cool to but there must be trophies. Gunner4life
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As a top club i expect trophies.
Currently I expect the carling cup, the premier league, and a win over barcelona ( we need that revenge). I we can get the quadruple then magnificent, but i wont mad if they don’t. However i expect to at least claim the premier league title, the carling cup and a pass to the UCL quaterfinals.
And Almunia and Squillaci out next summer.
It is straight and realistic. I know barcelona fixture is tough, but it cant be another defeat for us against those bastards, i mean how may more then? it was enough now we have van persie, fabregas, wilshere , walcott, so I expect a beautiful victory against barshitlona.
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the situation we as arsenal supporters find ourselves in is a privilaged one we watch some of the finest free flowing football in the world week in and week out(yes there is an occasional defensive shocker such as the 2nd half against newcastle but 4 me to watch that 1st half masterclass made it worth drawing that game as that will probally go down as the ultimate classic premier league match)we also are able to see the next world class stars come through our youth academy and this is only due to wenger philosphies.i think with in the next 3 years we will be the dominant force in england aswell as on the continent as half the teams entered into this years champs league will not be there once the uefa spending laws are inttoduced
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